[00:00] Jewels:

Listen in as Barnaby talks about his interpretation of resilience.

[00:07] Barnaby:

For me, resilience is really about not giving up. If you think you’re doing the right thing, keep doing it over and over again. Even if it doesn’t seem to be paying off, keep doing it. It will pay off.

Being resilient is not about going and lifting more weight than you thought you could, or eating a hot chilli that you never thought you could. It is about doing hard things, and things you’re not comfortable with, over and over again, even if they feel like they’re not paying off, and having the faith that they will.

[00:40] Jewels:

In this episode, I have the pleasure of talking with Barnaby Howarth.

A lot of people will tell you that if you don’t achieve what you’re aiming for, you’ve failed. But Barnaby Howarth thinks that as long as you couldn’t have tried any harder, you can be as proud as anyone else.

Barnaby has achieved a lot in life since being diagnosed with diabetes at 14, then suffering a stroke after being bashed in an alcohol-fuelled gang attack at 25. He played in the AFL for the Sydney Swans, has written his autobiography, filmed three documentaries, climbed Mount Kilimanjaro, played his 100th game for his local footy club, was inducted into the Sydney AFL Hall of Fame, and had another book published.

[01:25] Jewels:

He has built up a lot of resilience through his trials, and he needed every bit of it when his first wife was diagnosed with advanced breast cancer.

They went on 19 legs of their honeymoon, and now, as a sole trader and keynote speaker, Barnaby is passing on the lessons he’s learnt about how to be a more resilient person and how to be proud of being an everyday battler.

As well as giving speeches all around the world for groups such as Google, Nestlé, Linfox, Berkshire Hathaway Specialty Insurance, and the Sydney Swans, last year the Governor-General of Australia, Her Excellency Sam Mostyn AC, invited herself onto Barnaby’s podcast, Everyday Greatness.

Barnaby, welcome to the show.

[02:11] Barnaby:

Thanks, mate. Really good to be here. Thank you for having me.

[02:17] Jewels:

Mate, I’ll come back to this lacklustre bio in a second, because clearly not much has happened to you over the years. But I understand that you have a “don’t be a dickhead” policy.

[02:31] Barnaby:

Basically, yes. I grew up in an era, and under parents and grandparents, that really stressed the importance of humility. Roll your sleeves up, do your work, do it well, be proud of yourself, but once it’s done, it’s done. Don’t get on your soapbox and tell the world how good you are.

So, to talk in the language of this podcast, as a storyteller, I was more interested in creating the story. And creating the story was a lot easier when you didn’t have people dragging you down, or dickheads around you.

So I was so busy with my head down, focused on what I was doing, I wasn’t pumping my own tyres and telling my own story. Which, in some ways, has been a drawback. Financially, I’ve probably left a lot of money on the table. But in terms of a life to be proud of, I couldn’t be happier, mate.

[03:29] Jewels:

It seems like a bit of a contradiction in terms, doesn’t it? Not getting on your soapbox, but then having such an interesting backstory that you do have, and perhaps feeling the urge to share that story is quite a drawcard.

So how did you get into being a keynote speaker, for example, or even starting your own podcast? What were the things that drove you towards being a bit more public about who you are?

[04:00] Barnaby:

All that was kind of easy. It was kind of a forced hand.

After I had my stroke and became a person with disability, I was one subject away from finishing a journalism diploma at university. So when I got back on my feet, I went and finished that last subject and then applied for jobs at Channel 7, 9, 10, and the ABC.

Seven, Nine and Ten basically put me in the too-hard basket. Disability employment wasn’t really a thing back then, and I couldn’t convince these total strangers about the value I could bring to a role in a workplace when I didn’t really know who I was myself with my severe brain damage.

[05:00] Barnaby:

But then I went over the road to the ABC and applied for a job as a journalist there. The guy I applied with gave me a current affairs quiz. He called me in afterwards and said, “The pass mark for that quiz was 70 percent at the ABC. You got 40. I can’t give you a job. I’m sorry.”

So I went home with my tail between my legs, thinking I was going to have to stock shelves at my local supermarket. But then he rang the next day and said, “We’ve got a job in AutoCue. Do you want that?”

This guy was a massive Sydney Swans fan, and because I’d played at the Swans for a year, I think I was kind of fortunate that that was how the cards were dealt.

So he made a bit of a concerted effort to get me a job, to get my foot in the door.

[06:00] Barnaby:

Once my foot was in the door doing AutoCue, which pays very little and is the bottom rung of the ladder in a newsroom, I thought I’d climb the ladder internally and become a journalist.

But again, I had a few interviews internally and I couldn’t convince these people about the value I could bring to a role because I still didn’t know who I was.

So starting my business as a keynote speaker and resilience coach, and later as a podcaster, was kind of a forced hand. I had made some really dumb decisions with brain injury in day-to-day life, leaving keys and wallets behind, walking outside with no pants on, that sort of dumb stuff.

I thought if I did that in a company, with employees who relied on me, I didn’t want to drag them down.

[07:00] Barnaby:

So I decided to start this small business as a sole trader, so that if I made dumb decisions in my business, I wouldn’t bring employees down with me.

So I started out with a message that still is my message today: try your hardest, and be proud of yourself whether you win, lose or draw.

When I started 15 years ago, I was told it sounded like I was telling audiences to accept second best or celebrate mediocrity. But the more ruthless and aggressive and competitive the world gets, the more people enjoy being reminded that you can just roll your sleeves up, do your best, and if you don’t win, that’s not the end of the world. You can look your opponent in the eye, shake their hand, and say, “Well done.”

[08:00] Barnaby:

I had pretty high ambitions when I started my business in terms of how much money I’d earn, but when I lowered my sights and just focused on what I was doing and getting the job done as well as I could, the business turned out to be so much more rewarding than I ever would have thought.

Not a lack of ambition, but realistic sights. I wasn’t obsessed with making money and being ruthless and aggressive to get ahead. I just wanted to make enough money to support my family, pay for the ultimate wedding that my daughter wants, and be proud of the work I’m doing.

[08:37] Jewels:

So tell me a little bit about that, the joy that it’s brought you. Obviously, going from having some disability and then getting up on stage for the first time, it’s a fairly big transition, even for people who are half considering public speaking.

Tell me a little bit about that process for you, both mentally and consciously taking yourself through that process. Where did you start? How did you get the courage, for example, to even begin?

[09:16] Barnaby:

Yeah, so it was basically just a continuation of the person I was before my disability. I was school captain of my high school and I really enjoyed public speaking, reading the audience, getting to know the vibe and adjusting if you need to, or hammering home points that seem to be resonating. I really enjoyed that.

So I thought, well, as a sole trader, I’ve got no experience in anything. I’m not very good at business as an umbrella thing. So I thought keynote speaking is probably the easiest thing I can do. I can do payroll and make bookings and all that sort of stuff, and I can stand on a stage and talk to people.

[10:00] Barnaby:

So I more got into it out of necessity. I didn’t look at myself in the mirror and drum up courage and say, “Right, that’s what I want to do.” I just thought, “Well, I’m okay at that. I was okay at that before my disability. I need to earn a living. AutoCue won’t do it on its own. So I might just try keynote speaking.”

And I literally was just giving it a crack for the first few years. I thought, “This might earn me an extra couple of thousand dollars a year. That’d be cool.”

Then I got asked to speak at Google and Nestlé and Linfox, and I thought, “Oh shit, this is bigger than I thought.”

And then the Governor-General of Australia invited herself onto my podcast, which just blew me away.

[11:00] Barnaby:

And I think that only came about because of the lack of greed, the deep-seated humility, and the attempt to be a real human being rather than being aggressive and competitive and trying to get top dollar.

I think people in today’s world can see through that bullshit. If you’re just a genuine human being, people offer you things you hadn’t expected. And when you’re so focused on just looking down and doing your job as well as you can, sometimes things that happen off in the distance surprise you.

[11:19] Jewels:

So tell me a little bit about those opportunities that appeared. Obviously, you’ve got a story to tell and a bit of history behind that, and your early gigs probably gave you some visibility as well. But what was the transition between “I’m an unknown guy just trying to give it a crack” and actually becoming a bit more visible and having people like the Governor-General reach out to you and say, “Hey”? Why did she give you the time to be on your podcast?

[12:00] Barnaby:

Very simple. It’s just the people I surrounded myself with my whole life.

Before my disability, when I was a young bloke, my parents always said, “Just plant seeds of small goodness everywhere you go and have faith things will work out.”

Then, the older I got, the more that message was hammered home. I had a footy coach who said, “Focus on the game plan. The result will take care of itself.”

So I always thought: don’t worry about how you look, how you’re perceived, or the success that people think you might have. Just don’t be a dickhead.

[13:00] Barnaby:

Every day, every minute of every day, respect the people around you, be kind, not to the point of being overly sentimental, but just respecting people.

And I think that is what has helped me along the way. A perfect example is the Governor-General. Sam Mostyn was one of my first guests on the first episode of Everyday Greatness when it started 10 or 11 years ago.

She’d been the first female AFL Commissioner, helped the AFLW competition get up and running, and helped Paul Keating put on the Sydney Olympics.

I asked her, “Of all those things you’ve done, what’s the one priority you’d say matters most?” And she said, “I think I’m a good mum.”

That just blew me away.

[14:00] Barnaby:

I thought it was such a beautiful, human, humble answer. I posted about that quote on social media because I was so amazed by it.

Then last September we happened to be at the same event. This time she was Governor-General, and she came up to me and said, “You and I need to run the interview.”

And that was all based on how we got along.

We knew each other before that first podcast episode through Sydney AFL where I was playing and she was an administrator. We always chatted, got along, respected each other, and had nice, kind conversations.

We weren’t best mates. We just got along well as human beings.

[15:00] Barnaby:

And later on, years down the track, someone once said, “You don’t always remember what someone says to you, but you remember how they make you feel.”

And Sam Mostyn and I always made each other feel comfortable. Every time we spoke, I walked away feeling better than I did when we started.

That accumulation of those things is what leads you to opportunities further down the track.

[15:54] Jewels:

I think it’s a beautiful philosophy, because I think you’re right. In a world where we’ve become more aggressive, more competitive, constantly fighting for influence and attention, we’re barraged by noise.

It’s incredibly refreshing to hear that just being a good person is enough and that it can take you a long way if you foster that and truly believe it.

[16:32] Barnaby:

Finally, take me. It’s not just about finding success and being something and being better than you are. It’s about mental health and serious things, about not going down the slide the other way.

I personally think a lot of mental health problems come from that weight of pressure and expectation on people to be the best. And if you’re not the best, work harder, eat better, wake up earlier, hustle more. I couldn’t disagree with that more.

I think if you’re not the best, but you want to be the best and work really hard, be good to the people around you and have faith, things will work out.

[17:00] Barnaby:

I’ve felt a lot of times that my business has been a waste of time and a failure, and I’d see all these people climbing the ladder quickly, influencing people, making noise.

But it’s all just white noise, mate. There are so many pseudo-experts out there.

At some stages I’ve been tempted to think, “If you can’t beat them, join them.” But I thought, no, just stay true to who you are, be authentic, and make decisions you think are right.

And as soon as the Governor-General said to me, “Let’s do another interview,” it was like the light went off. I realised it had been worth it.

[17:32] Jewels:

A mate of mine once described his partner as being “a good human,” and that term has stuck with me for a long time.

Just being a good human is, at its core, where we should start, right? It’s the essence of who we are. And I think, like you say, we’ve gone in the wrong direction in a lot of ways.

I want to take you back, if you don’t mind, to just before your incident where you had, in your words, been bashed in an alcohol-fuelled gang attack. What was your life like just before that?

[18:00] Barnaby:

I thought I was on the way. I thought the world was my oyster. I was captain of my footy club, I’d been school captain of my high school, I was studying a journalism diploma with a view to travelling the world and telling stories of vulnerable people and becoming someone.

I felt like I was on the precipice of something massive.

So when I had the stroke, I thought it was a blip. I thought, “Well, this sucks, but I’ll work hard and roll my sleeves up, do the physio, do what I need to do, and get back to the path I was on.”

That obviously changed the trajectory of the path I was on. But I think I’m prouder of the path I’m on now than I would have been had I gone on to be somebody.

[18:42] Jewels:

So describe those early days after the stroke. Was there a lot of rehabilitation? Were you able to speak, for example, or has that been part of the recovery process too?

[18:54] Barnaby:

It was actually a really exciting time to have a stroke.

Before I had my stroke, neuroplasticity didn’t really exist as a mainstream concept. The theory was that the human brain is what it is, and if it’s damaged, there’s no real chance of recovery because it’s fixed.

But then neuroplasticity came out, especially through Dr Norman Doidge, who said the brain is plastic and you can change behaviour, learning and functionality if you repeat processes over and over again.

[19:39] Barnaby:

So when I started rehab, my left side is my affected side, and I was doing this exercise where I had to get beads out of a bowl with a spoon and put them into a cup, then reverse it.

Every time I did it, I thought, “This is such a waste of time.”

Then neuroplasticity came out and you could see the therapists’ eyes light up. They just kept saying, “Do it over and over again.”

The one thing that got me through rehab was a metaphor Norman Doidge used in The Brain That Changes Itself. He said the brain is like a ski hill first thing in the morning, where fresh snow covers all the tracks.

[20:24] Barnaby:

If you start skiing down, you’ll naturally fall into the old tracks because they’re deeply embedded.

But if you want to make a new track, you can. You just need to keep going down it over and over again and follow the same track repeatedly.

So rehab for me was not like a foot injury where you work hard for a couple of days and suddenly things are awesome.

Stroke rehab is different. You keep doing things over and over again, even though they feel like a waste of time. Inside your brain, they’re creating new pathways. Eventually, you look back a few months later and realise it’s been working.

[21:32] Jewels:

What do you think we can learn from that, not even as stroke survivors, but if you’re just trying to learn a new skill?

There’s obviously a correlation between doing something once and giving up. I talk a lot about muscle memory. Learning a new skill can be repetitive and boring, but if you continue to do it, there’s a skill build-up. This is available to all of us, right?

[22:00] Barnaby:

I use that mindset for most things I do in life. If I’m doing something well and it’s not working, I know that if I keep doing it well it will eventually sink in.

The most successful people I’ve met, including the Governor-General, are the ones who don’t stop being good human beings.

Being a good person and expecting results is frustrating and tough, and it’s a long game. You don’t get instant rewards.

The people who become successful are the ones who don’t see rewards but keep saying, “No, I know this is the right thing. I’ll keep going.”

[23:00] Barnaby:

The ones who fall into a heap are the ones who go, “That sucks. I tried being nice and didn’t get a result, so I’m going to be an arsehole and get instant success.”

They might get a big pay cheque or a promotion in the short term. But ten years down the track nobody wants to be around them.

So to me it’s not rocket science. It’s not about some big act of courage. It’s about understanding that not being a dickhead is going to pay off, but not in the short term. It’s a long-term game.

[24:03] Jewels:

So your public speaking gigs mainly focus around resilience. Tell me a little bit about resilience, what it means to you, and how we can learn from some of these tough times.

[24:21] Barnaby:

Firstly, I need to let people know that I think I am a resilient person, but I’m not a resilience expert. I’ve got no idea what the science says or what strategies people adopt.

But for me, resilience is all about not giving up.

If you think you’re doing the right thing, keep doing it over and over again, even if it doesn’t seem to be paying off. Keep doing it. It will.

Being resilient is not about lifting more weight than you thought you could or eating a hot chilli you never thought you could.

It’s about doing hard things, and doing things you’re not comfortable with, over and over again, even when they feel like they’re not paying off, and having faith that they will.

[25:13] Barnaby:

My old footy coach used to say, “Practice doesn’t make perfect. Perfect practice makes perfect.”

So if you’re trying to get from this point to this point, don’t do it half-arsed. Do it well.

I think there was a misconception early on that I was telling people being lazy is okay. That’s not it at all. You’ve got to do the work, and you’ve got to do good work.

If you are doing it as well as you think you can, then have faith that things will end up the way you want them to.

[26:03] Jewels:

In today’s society there’s this thing about immediate gratification. Everything needs to happen within seconds.

So I think we’ve learned to dismiss things if they don’t give us that instant gratification. I see it in younger generations especially. “I need this thing and I need it now.”

What you’re describing is refreshing because it’s the opposite of what you hear. We’ve gone down this path of trying something once and, if it doesn’t work, trying something else, then something else again. I like this idea of the long game.

[27:00] Barnaby:

That rush straight to short-term reward just takes away from anybody’s desire to work hard for a long time. Why would you, if something else promises results in 30 seconds?

I find it really frustrating. And it’s where I fell down early on with my own business.

Because I wasn’t blowing my own trumpet and getting on my soapbox, I was talking about exactly what I’m telling you today: work hard for a long time and have faith things will pay off.

Back then people said, “No mate, that doesn’t work now.” And I thought, “Well, that’s all I’ve done. I’m not going to make stuff up and be someone I’m not.”

[28:00] Barnaby:

But I’m not saying for one second that short-term, attention-grabbing stuff is bad. In fact, I’ve got help now producing my podcast.

My podcasts are full of meaning and really deep, valuable conversations. But the world needs short, attention-grabbing stuff to drag people into the long-form content.

So I don’t think one is right and the other is wrong. I think they both need to work together.

Just because things are different doesn’t mean they have to be antagonistic. They can come together and make each other better.

[29:00] Jewels:

A few years ago I stumbled across the concept of slow food. During the week, sure, fast food is convenient. But on the weekend I like to slow-cook and savour those moments.

I think skills are a little bit like that. If you learn something quickly and expect it to be done quickly, there’s only a certain depth of value you can produce from it. But if you take the time to learn, refine and adjust over years, that skill comes into its own.

Have we forgotten how to live life? Are we too obsessed with squeezing the most out of today that we can’t see the forest for the trees anymore?

[30:00] Barnaby:

I don’t think so. I’m fairly optimistic about the world, and especially Australia. I think this country is unbelievable.

I think at the moment short-term gratification is getting the upper hand, but I don’t think we’ve lost appreciation for a good life.

One of the best testimonials I’ve had for my speaking came after I spoke to a Year 12 group in Adelaide. People told me early on that I needed short, catchy reactions and testimonials. But I didn’t really care about how people felt in the moment. I wanted to know what actually stuck.

[31:00] Barnaby:

A young kid came up to me afterwards and said, “I saw you speak when I was in Year 9, I’ve done everything you said, and now I’m here as a Year 12 prefect.”

And I thought, that is exactly what I want out of my business.

I don’t want the short-term testimonial stuff. I want the stuff that people sit with for a long time and realise, “Hang on, that thing that guy said six months ago is working.”

So no, I don’t think we’ve lost it. But like muscle memory, you need to keep developing it or we will lose it.

[32:00] Barnaby:

I want to see more social media where people actually tell stories.

Rather than a quick “here’s what I’m doing right now,” I want to see a story unfold over time. That kind of storytelling is so powerful. It’s just been badly used at the moment, in my opinion.

[32:38] Jewels:

So tell me a little bit about storytelling. This is the Storytllr podcast, right? It started around business storytelling, but I think storytelling from an individual perspective is really where it’s at.

What’s that process for you when you think about going up on stage and making an impact on somebody? Which stories resonate the most?

[33:16] Barnaby:

I think the one thing that gets in the way of telling a good, wholesome, long-term story is agenda.

When people go into telling a story with an ideal result in mind, that’s when the story becomes useless.

If you go into a conversation with someone just to have a nice conversation, not because you think they might give you a job or buy you a coffee, that’s the right spirit.

Storytelling is exactly the same. Just tell your story. If you’ve done something you’re really proud of, tell it. Don’t tell it because you think it might get you 5,000 more followers.

[34:00] Barnaby:

I’ve heard so many stories from people who have been reluctant to tell their story because they don’t think it’s that big a deal.

There was a young African kid in a school storytelling session who said, “I don’t think my story is that good.” When asked what his story was, he said that back in Ethiopia his dad couldn’t afford to send them all to school, so he raised enough money to send him and his two brothers to Australia to live with their auntie.

That’s an incredible story. But the kid didn’t think it was.

That’s what happens when people think stories only matter if they promise some kind of obvious payoff.

[35:00] Barnaby:

Go into telling a story without an agenda and people will want to listen.

It doesn’t matter how banal or boring you think your story is. If you’re proud of it, tell it.

[35:36] Jewels:

What’s one of your favourite stories? You’ve done quite a lot of things. Which one are you most proud of, and which one do you share on stage that gets the biggest reaction?

[36:14] Barnaby:

On this long-term, be-a-good-human stuff, it’s actually a story that’s different from all of those.

When I was younger, before my stroke, I knew Emmanuel and Ahmed Kelly. Emmanuel is the young bloke who just opened for Coldplay. Ahmed won silver medals for Australia at the Paralympics.

I knew them as kids, and when I got my disability, that shared experience created a bond.

[37:00] Barnaby:

Emmanuel had a huge rise, appearing on The X Factor, and Yoko Ono even said John Lennon would have been proud of his performance.

Then his fame started to fade and he didn’t cope well. He became homeless, struggled with drugs and alcohol, and hit a rough patch.

Eventually he decided he had to do something about it. So he went to the suburb in England where he knew Chris Martin was from and literally walked around asking people if they knew him.

Eventually, someone did.

[38:00] Barnaby:

He met Chris Martin, told him one day he was going to open for him, and Chris said, “You’ve got a bit of work to do, mate, but we’ll stay in touch.”

Those two developed a respectful friendship. Later, Chris Martin asked him to open for Coldplay when they toured Australia.

One of the proudest things that’s happened in my life is that Emmanuel made sure I got tickets. So my daughter and I went and saw him open for Coldplay.

I’ve got a beautiful relationship with my daughter, a real no-bullshit, no-dickheads relationship. So that was a very meaningful moment.

[39:58] Jewels:

Yeah, nice. I was at one of those Coldplay concerts too. He should have called you up on stage.

[40:12] Barnaby:

I’ve actually asked Chris Martin, through Emmanuel, to be my guest on Everyday Greatness. Chris Martin’s coming back to Australia next year, so here’s hoping.

[40:25] Jewels:

Have you heard from his agents?

[40:27] Barnaby:

I only sent the email last week.

[40:33] Jewels:

Nice, keep going.

Tell me a little bit about mental health and coping in a resilience sense. Any one of the things you’ve been through could have sent a person into a spiral. How do you deal with the stresses of so much going on in your life?

[41:00] Barnaby:

I used to say I just got really lucky. My mental health doesn’t waver a lot. If something good happens, it doesn’t go through the roof. If something bad happens, it doesn’t go through the floor. I just keep a pretty level head most of the time.

And I often feel lucky that I didn’t go down, because I think getting up from being down would be really difficult.

So the way I’ve staved off mental health issues is not to get too up or down about anything.

[42:00] Barnaby:

I had a stroke and it sucked. I lost my wife to breast cancer and it sucked. But I looked back on the life I’d lived before both of those things and I was really proud of what I’d done before them.

Losing my first wife was one of the most tragic things I’ve ever experienced, but the life we led was so beautiful.

So the pride and the tragedy averaged out and kept me pretty level.

One of the best pieces of advice I ever heard was: “If you can’t see the light, just wait. It will come.”

[43:00] Jewels:

Nice. I think we can all learn a little from that. I think I’m a little bit lucky in that regard too. I’m a very level-headed sort of person.

It helps me cope. And where possible, I try to nip that feeling in the bud. If I’m starting to feel a bit down, I’ll call someone, surround myself with a good person, do something that lifts the day before it gets too deep.

[43:37] Barnaby:

When I was playing Aussie Rules, they used to say if an umpire has had a good game, they won’t hear a thing. They don’t get cheered and they don’t get booed.

That’s the way I try and live my life. I don’t care about being known as some sensational leader or inspiration.

At the end of my days, I want my daughter to look at me and go, “That’s the kind of person I want to be.”

[44:46] Jewels:

That’s a perfect segue for my final question. Where do you see the next 15 years? What do you want to do with your speaking career? What are your goals for what you do and how you inspire?

[45:00] Barnaby:

Exactly the same goals as when I started out. I just want to keep providing for my family and be a reliable human being.

I want my family to be able to depend on me.

With my speaking, same thing as the Year 12 guy. I don’t want to shoot the lights out every night and be a powerhouse and inspiration in some short-term way.

I want people to know that what I was speaking about when I first started is the same stuff I’ll be speaking about in five or ten years’ time.

[46:00] Barnaby:

I want people to know that my speaking presentations, my podcast and my resilience coaching are pretty bloody good.

That’s what I want in the next five years.

[46:30] Jewels:

Fabulous. Look, Barnaby, I haven’t known you for very long, but I know that you are a good human and you’re doing some really good work.

You’re a top bloke, you’re not a dickhead, which is an absolute bonus.

Please keep doing what you’re doing, keep sharing your story, keep using your enthusiasm because it is infectious.

Where can people find out a little bit more?

[47:00] Barnaby:

Sorry, before I tell you where, can I tell you a quick story?

[47:04] Jewels:

Oh yeah, please. Go for it.

[47:07] Barnaby:

So when I talk about how bloody good Australia is, it’s how you and I know each other, mate.

We didn’t know each other, but we had a mutual friend. She said, “I know this guy Barnaby, you guys should meet and catch up.”

We caught up, had a coffee, no agenda, just “let’s see what this person’s about.”

And here we are on a podcast together.

I think that’s the beautiful thing about Australia. People can come together from different backgrounds and different experiences and just trust people.

[48:00] Jewels:

Yeah, Georgia is another example of a good human. I’ve literally spent less than an hour with Georgia and it feels like we’re old friends already.

I think good humans attract good humans too.

Yes, there are times when people can take advantage of that goodness, but I think as an underlying ethos, it’s a good thing.

Less dickheads, more good humans.

[48:44] Barnaby:

Very true. I think we live in a beautiful time in world history where vulnerability is seen as a strength.

The stuff that people used to see as a weakness is now a strength.

That doesn’t mean you need to be soft and weak. You can still be firm and tough and stand your ground, but just be kind to people.

[49:08] Jewels:

Perfect. Mate, where can people find out a bit more about you? Because they should.

And if anybody has a speaking gig where they need an awesome speaker, Barnaby is your man. Where can they find you?

[49:21] Barnaby:

Thank you, mate. I’ll flick you ten percent.

[49:24] Jewels:

Just ten? I was thinking more twenty.

[49:27] Barnaby:

Yeah, well, beggars can’t be choosers.

Getting in touch on my social media is probably the best spot. LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram.

I do have a website, though it hasn’t been updated for a while, barnabyhowarth.com.

Or to see what I’m doing, go to my podcast page, Everyday Greatness with Barnaby Howarth on YouTube.

[50:00] Jewels:

I’ll put all of those links in the show notes. So if you’re looking to get in contact, please do.

Mate, thanks so much for your time. It’s been an absolute pleasure and we should do this again.

[50:13] Barnaby:

Privilege, mate. Sounds good. Thank you for having me.

[50:16] Jewels:

Cheers.

There are so many lessons to be learned from that discussion with Barnaby. I think he’s an amazing human, but I absolutely just love his little motto of “just don’t be a dickhead.”

Much love. Chat soon.